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List of new maps to be included

https://knightsandmerchants.net:443/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2032

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Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2014, 19:18
by pawel95
@maplist to add: we forgot this: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1665

@To's AtD: check this "RA FAKE": viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1322
Your link is wrong. I know To´s fix. Read again my post, I have spoken about the R.A fan fix with the " BR 8P FtR" sufix.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2014, 19:20
by vovets1
Barbarians in history, now on across are scouts, as in original.
Is Lewin has already added some fixes - ok, but i see no one fixed Land of Hills or battle for coal for example. These maps are unplayable now.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2014, 19:33
by andreus
@maplist to add: we forgot this: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1665

@To's AtD: check this "RA FAKE": viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1322
Your link is wrong. I know To´s fix. Read again my post, I have spoken about the R.A fan fix with the " BR 8P FtR" sufix.
sorry, misunderstood :D

ok, RA fix that uploaded here is old... we updated it since kamnet's version. we just added some resources, fixed wrong tiles, added building space for some locs, added a new way to locs 2 and 3...

p.s. yes I know answers: these fixes are for noobs, don't touch originals... so just forget about our fixes :D

p.p.s. let's stop this senseless discussion about fixes of originals.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2014, 20:13
by Ben
Ben, you think that our fixes aren't tested? Hehehe, you aren't right.
Also, if Lewin dont want to see duplicated maps, why he added Center Castle? It's REMAKED BORDER RIVERS + scripted variant.
No, he doesn't want duplicates of maps. There are reasons behind the ones we have now. The one in your example is because Lewin needed missions with scripts for the latest release of the Remake. It takes a lot of time to make maps so instead some maps just had scripts added to them

I never said your map wasn't tested. However, if you think that you have tested your version more than To tested his fix, you are the one who is mistaken.
For the record, I am vehemently apposed to this change, and I vote to not use it in the official Remake.

As for Across the Desert "fix" that RA change is ridiculous. Made the map way worse than it is now. Sure that map has some problems but it is still playable.

Personally, I think that the original maps that have prebuilds/starting troops don't need these bonuses. However, these maps are also, incidentally, the unplayable--some just by their nature:
1) Bridge Disaster: More like camp disaster.
2) Mountainous Region: Camp disaster 2.0
3) Battle for Coal: Not many thoughts. If I remember correctly, some locations had huge disadvantage in tree number.
4) Land of Hills: Beside the unneeded prebuild, there are problems with people building into enemy territory and some people have huge disadvantage with resource placement (like coal is far away from iron+gold for some; close for others).

Again, these are my thoughts. HOWEVER, I think that any changes to original maps should not be done without much care and consideration.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 23 Jan 2014, 22:07
by woloszek
Could you write font color for maps names? This will help in fast finding maps. There are more posts ... so.. :wink:

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 00:20
by sado1
Way too few Singleplayer maps. Me as big Singleplayer fan and tester, I tested a few maps few months ago after a request of Lewin.
Might be that you were AFK then, but that's exactly why I asked you on TS right before I started this topic, to help me especially with SP/coop maps :D
+Decaying hearts, purified (White Wolf)
+Lava Valley (Andreus, not sure if I have the newest verision)
+Revenge in the garden (Vatrix, it´s not the final version in the Map Repo, but it´s quite funny mission)
+Forgotten(Hmm don´t know who is the author of that nice map :P )
+Enemy of an enemy (The Raging Bullet, few missions of his campaign ?! ) ?

Tactical/Coop:
+BattlePit(by sado)
+Cursed Land (by Woloszek and Pakerteam)
+The Last Hope (Andreus, coop)
+In the Middle of nowhere (Tiank) ?

Gorges(Andreus, Fixed script)
Added, see below, added, need an author, added, I'm unsure whether battlepit is up to Remake standards, was already on the list, was already on the list as an SP map (is it coop or sp?), added, see below.
"below": I'm afraid it's too hard to make a list of Andreus' updated maps, so I'm not gonna even try, hoping he will provide them to Lewin himself ;P Especially that half of those were not released here, will be better to see Andreus make a bundle of all these maps then send it to the devs.
and Happy_end made campaign "World War II", with dynamic scripts, and campaign "The Middle-Earth" by godmenm
Link for the Middle Earth campaign please, would like to check it out. About WWII: I'm unsure whether such a campaign (which totally doesn't fit KaM with its theme) should be included in the Remake, can you imagine a new player opening the campaign list to see a WWII campaign with normal KaM troops?

That whole original map remakes offtopic. Is this discussion really needed here? On the other hand though, you reminded me of the BR 8P remake by Thunder&community, I added it to the list. Anyone who wants to praise it or moan about it, go to its topic though, please.

And I hope Thunder isn't angry that I just pasted his topic instead of listing all the maps... I was a bit tired of making the list when I put him there xD

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 03:12
by vovets1
Ok Pawel, i'll give a link when i return home.
Ben, ok, u see that we all need to see our fixes, and only after that say somethink. Now its only big off topic of prejudes. I'll give a link for it too.

Also. We have over 50 maps & fixes. Why everyone paid their attention only on across and wilderness! :D

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 03:19
by Ben
I'll give a link for it too.
I'll take a look. Where is the link though?
Also. We have over 50 maps & fixes. Why everyone paid their attention only on across and wilderness! :D
Because those maps are fine. The others are not :P Also, the Across fix was legitimately bad; no offence.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 06:52
by Lewin
Ok this is a lot of maps. We are going to need to delete quite a few if we are adding this many.

Regarding overwriting original maps by downloading in the lobby, this is not the right topic to discuss that. I've made a post about it here.

@Andreus: At the moment Pawel is in charge of fixing the original campaigns and co-operative missions. So you will have to discuss your fixes with him.

I would be quite happy to have a team of people reviewing maps and advising which ones should or shouldn't be included. That doesn't mean we would do exactly as they say, but it could save us a lot of time by filtering out the low quality maps before I look at them.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 06:56
by andreus
I'm afraid it's too hard to make a list of Andreus' updated maps, so I'm not gonna even try, hoping he will provide them to Lewin himself ;P Especially that half of those were not released here, will be better to see Andreus make a bundle of all these maps then send it to the devs.
hehe, ok, I'll post some of them here and later send them to Lewin :P

alnd please add these maps to list:
+ Jero's Horse-Pike-Sword
+ dicso's A Path Beyond and Leap of Faith
@Andreus: At the moment Pawel is in charge of fixing the original campaigns and co-operative missions. So you will have to discuss your fixes with him.
ok ;)

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 08:36
by dicsoupcan
and please add these maps to list:
+ dicso's A Path Beyond and Leap of Faith
No, just no. those maps are of poor quality and untested.

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 09:12
by Duke Valennius
To do some self-criticism please remove my map "Glittering Mountains". I find it quite disgusting to look at, and I abandoned it after finishing the script. If someone feels like redoing the terrain, suit yourself. I find it an example of ugliness at the current state :D

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 09:25
by sado1
alnd please add these maps to list:
+ Jero's Horse-Pike-Sword
+ dicso's A Path Beyond and Leap of Faith
I deliberately did not add them , seeing as Dicso's maps are of poor quality AND he agres with that, and HPS is kinda too extreme - if we have too many maps then this one would be one of the first to delete anyway.
I would be quite happy to have a team of people reviewing maps and advising which ones should or shouldn't be included. That doesn't mean we would do exactly as they say, but it could save us a lot of time by filtering out the low quality maps before I look at them.
I'd say let's take a few of the best and most critical mapmakers out there. TDL, To, Ben maybe. I'd add Thunder but somehow I think his heart is too soft for such a job :P I could help sorting the maps out as well, if it wouldn't be a problem that my maps are crap. Also, I'd advise to ask Romek to look at those maps (as he's the most critical person about the maps, ever) but I'm not sure he'd have time/desire to help us; also, he'd eliminate 95% of the maps :P

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 11:38
by Lewin
An important note to map authors: Please remove spectator locations. Now that the Remake has spectating implemented we don't want those spectator locations confusing everyone.
I would be quite happy to have a team of people reviewing maps and advising which ones should or shouldn't be included. That doesn't mean we would do exactly as they say, but it could save us a lot of time by filtering out the low quality maps before I look at them.
I'd say let's take a few of the best and most critical mapmakers out there. TDL, To, Ben maybe. I'd add Thunder but somehow I think his heart is too soft for such a job :P I could help sorting the maps out as well, if it wouldn't be a problem that my maps are crap. Also, I'd advise to ask Romek to look at those maps (as he's the most critical person about the maps, ever) but I'm not sure he'd have time/desire to help us; also, he'd eliminate 95% of the maps :P
Sounds good to me :) Another thing that would save me time is if you collected all of the latest versions of the map folders from their authors and sent them to me. Any help I can get with maps will be appreciated since I'm already busy coding, and you set me a tight deadline to have RC1 ready by early February ;)

Re: List of new maps to be included

PostPosted: 24 Jan 2014, 12:57
by vovets1
Why?
We have only 2 loc for spectating, but with extra loc in map we'll have 3 or 4 locs.
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