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Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2014, 01:43
by Lewin
GG. It´s because of this error:
That was the rare and unknown error where computers get out of sync in multiplayer, we haven't figured out why that happens yet. It has existed since the first multiplayer demo (it's fairly rare).
That error causes the game to crash on all clients, it's not really related to replays.
well that is why you crashed, but my replays keep breaking consistently on consistency failure. might the the back to lobby button, i have no idea.
Loading a save (or returning to the lobby) could be causing issues. Was the replay error at the time you returned to the lobby? Did you change anything while in the lobby? These inconsistency errors are really hard to track down, if you can reproduce the error reliably that would be very helpful for me to start debugging it.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 03 Jul 2014, 06:52
by pawel95
While he was playing, he returned a few times to the lobby and also let me in, to spectate the game :p that's why I meant, that my error that I got should be in a connection to the error in the replay. He also load an autoave one time as far as I remember.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 08:21
by vovets1
Dear developers, the last nightly build is very nice, but it's one problem. You made a new priority, where serfs carry timbers earlier than stones. It's good. But serfs carry timbers earlier than they carry stones to roads!!!
Their algorithm:
1). Serfs bring timbers to houses
2). Serfs bring stones to roads
3). Serfs bring stones to houses.
It's incorrect. Builders start to build a house, they do wooden frame, and go away. To build another wooden frame. And after some frames they can see that stones are in their place and build the house.
How it should be:
1). Serfs bring stones to roads
2). Serfs bring timbers to houses
3). Serfs bring stones to houses.
It would be more comfortable.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 08:42
by pawel95
I brang that idea to deliver wood first, but I haven't seriously noticed that the "bring stone to road"task hasn't the biggest priority anymore
good finding.
Sure it should be changed like you said. Bringing wood to houses before finishing new roads would change the system of kams working system drastically
However I am not sure anymore how it should be. I think that finishing a house should have a higher priority than finishing roads, right?? However you still found a bug then, becaus the stone-road prio is between the wood-house and the stone-house prio.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 09:23
by vovets1
In 5503 serfs bring stones to road before they bring resources (randomly) to houses. I dont mind, it's ok for me. But maybe your priority will be better, who knows?
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 13:53
by Lewin
Actually building supplies to houses is the same priority as for roads, so it's distance based (with a small random element). Pseudo code:
Bid := Distance + Random(5)
if IsStoneToHouse then Bid := Bid + 10
Lowest bid is chosen. So yes for similar distances stone to houses is a lower priority, but for slightly longer distances it's not so simple. IIRC r5503 was the same, but without the +10 for stone to houses (so houses/roads were the same priority for serfs).
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 14:53
by vovets1
Hehe, you just added extra number to StoneToHouse, and serfs now bring stones if they can bring timbers to building what places further that 10 tiles, or they can't bring it in principle
I think to hard to make priorites as i said + what Lewin said. But i hope that devs will solve this problem. Otherwise the old system is better. I prefer to wait one timber instead of wait all stones.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 15:07
by Lewin
Hehe, you just added extra number to StoneToHouse, and serfs now bring stones if they can bring timbers to building what places further that 10 tiles, or they can't bring it in principle
I think to hard to make priorites as i said + what Lewin said. But i hope that devs will solve this problem. Otherwise the old system is better. I prefer to wait one timber instead of wait all stones.
I can make WoodToHouse = +10 and StoneToHouse = +20, then roads of a similar distance will be delivered first, then wood to houses, then stone to houses. However, this is quite different from the old r5503 system where all 3 were the same priority... (roads were not preferred over houses in r5503)
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 16:10
by vovets1
Good idea
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 04 Jul 2014, 18:11
by pawel95
I just had my first serious eco game in the newest nightly and indeed it´s a bit strange. I had like school finished(perfect, wood before stone) but with a normal "TS" gameplay building like forester and stonemeasons in the same time for example i had this situation:
2 stonemeasons with each 3 wood
1 forester with 3 wood and 1 stone
While the forester was made a bit earlier and has way closer distance to the storehouse.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2014, 02:40
by Lewin
But would it cause more problems if roads become a higher priority for serfs than houses? In r5503 people expect to see materials being delivered to houses at equal priority as delivering stones to roads (when the distances are similar).
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2014, 05:17
by vovets1
Hmm. Really, i thought that stones to road was in higher priority, but if this is wrong....
We can alwaus return to old system. Also, we can test others models.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2014, 09:02
by Krom
IMHO that is much too many micro. Having all to be the same priority would be okay, what do you say?
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2014, 09:31
by sado1
But would it cause more problems if roads become a higher priority for serfs than houses? In r5503 people expect to see materials being delivered to houses at equal priority as delivering stones to roads (when the distances are similar).
We have direct control over placing road plans. Therefore, if I want serfs to bring stuff to the building sites, I can simply stop making more plans. This is actually what everyone is/should be doing in competitive multiplayer - avoid placing hundreds of road plans at once, so maybe such a change would have a positive impact on players when they would notice that they are building roads only for all the time (although for randoms it happens all the time and they don't notice it anyway, so maybe hope is lost for them
). So roads as a priority make sense to me.
Re: KaM Remake nightly build
PostPosted: 05 Jul 2014, 09:52
by vovets1
Vote for old random system =)